I think about the afterlife a lot, mostly because I no longer accept that there is such a thing. The wish is still there, but the conviction has vanished.
This process of changing context, of moving from faith to doubt to skepticism, has been long and gradual. There was a time when I was thoroughly immersed in the belief, when I was a young boy, terrified of Satan and his wood-fired brick ovens, all cranked up and crammed with the burning flesh of axe murderers and also people who had forgotten to go to church one Sunday and then stepped out into the street without looking both ways.
Hell was but a single option out of the three open to an expired Catholic, and by far the worst. It was a terrible place, which was probably how it got its name. Had it been just moderately unpleasant, it might have been called Heck, or Sam Hill Station, or maybe the Hades Motor Lodge, with the ferrymen on the rivers to the underworld offering light refreshments to their passengers.
Instead we got a dungeon of flames, pools of sulfur, and three-headed dogs. Being sentenced to eternal damnation meant you were in for a miserable existence, where mere agony and anguish would be things to look forward to. In fact, if Hell were listed on one of those travel websites today, most of the reviews would be pretty negative:
“Dinner burnt every night and air conditioning never worked. Mini-fridge stocked with hot sauce. Fire alarm blaring constantly. Worst of all, ad said free breakfast, but we were charged anyway. Manager and staff all extremely rude.”
And yet, my most secret desire was to see it with my own eyes. I wanted to wander around for a while, an afternoon jaunt, the way you might stroll into a cemetery just for that sense of relief that comes with being able to stroll back out. But visitors’ passes, I suspected, were not available to the general public. Tickets were one-way and non-transferable. All sales were final.
For me, Hell was something like the basement of a long-condemned warehouse, a dark and acrid pit overflowing with evil shadows and the screams of the hopeless. That impression was a composite of what I had learned in religion class and the images and feelings I collected when my cousin and I ventured to the lowest depths of his apartment building. It was all dust and decay and dim piles of death and desertion down there. And, of course, the incinerator – a massive metal door concealing a blaze that burned without end. Anything put into the chute would fall into that merciless heat and be converted to ash, just as the holy martyrs of early Christianity had been tortured and killed by the Romans. And just as all sinners who died without grace were destined to be consumed forever.
This picture was reaffirmed in countless films, all depicting relentless suffering and howling wickedness. According to the movies, the road to Hell was mostly paved with signed contracts – bargains the greedy and the gullible would make with the devil, pledging their immortal souls in exchange for a few years of wealth and influence, or for another taste of youth.
Those souls were valuable assets. I was never quite sure what gave them such worth, but the devil hoarded them the way wealthy celebrities collect antique sports cars, or the way struggling writers stockpile paper clips and old computer cables. He could never have enough.
The devil was also a skilled salesman and was always trying to get people to write their names on sheets of paper. These would become legal documents, which he would fold up and put into his pocket, only to pull them out later when it was time to collect. Sometimes the wording would change after the signature had been inscribed, so that the person was unaware of what they had agreed to. This added to the devil’s reputation as a ruthless liar, a hideous creature who had horns and a tail and carried around a pitchfork, but who also happened to be a snappy dresser.
In school, we were allowed to use only fountain pens. I prayed that Satan’s was a ball-point, because that would help me resist him, even if he were waving a new model train set in front of my face, or a ten-year supply of Milk Duds, or free pizza for life. My soul, apparently, could command such a price.
Marcia
September 9, 2013
The hell I pictured as a child was terrifying. My grandmother and her sisters were pentocostal and very rigid with rules broken that would send you there. My parents belonged to a square dancing club. They loved dancing. Of course, I would go to Grandma to babysit. She always had me so upset by the time my parents got back because they were damned. I, too, have moved away from religion. My grandchildren have never had to worry about judgement in any way. Great post!
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bronxboy55
September 9, 2013
Square dancing? You can’t get any more morally corrupt than that. We had an old priest who would tell us that our parents were going to Hell for not coming to Church. They were difficult things to hear when you believed they might be true. Thanks for the comment, Marcia. I’m glad you survived it.
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cat
September 9, 2013
… maybe it would be better to lead a miserable life now … maybe then we’d escape hell … For example, in my childhood years one of my tactics was: Cry hard before you get whooped, then the whooping might be milder … Love your writing, Mr. Bronx Boy 🙂 Always, cat.
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bronxboy55
September 9, 2013
That’s a novel approach, cat. I hope it worked.
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Staff
September 9, 2013
Reblogged this on SoshiTech.
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bronxboy55
September 9, 2013
Thanks. I’m glad you liked it.
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The Sandwich Lady
September 9, 2013
The Hades Motor Lodge sounds like it might rate a half star above Hojos. I still believe in hell but, perhaps naively, think it won’t be crowded. And I too hoard old computer cables and it’s hell remembering where they are supposed to go.
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bronxboy55
September 9, 2013
Catherine, I still have a 300-baud modem, and I can’t even remember what baud means.
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Carol Deminski
September 9, 2013
Struggling writers stockpile old computer cables? I never knew that. Darn, I need to begin my collection immediately.
On second thought, I don’t even remember the last time I used a paper clip.
Uh oh…
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bronxboy55
September 9, 2013
Maybe you’re not struggling, Carol. I hope that’s the case.
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Carol Deminski
September 10, 2013
Thanks Charles, you’re very kind to say so. And “struggling” is relative; even successful writers struggle from time to time. (And “successful” is also relative!) 😉
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chagrinnamontoast
September 9, 2013
As the granddaughter of Southern Baptist missionaries, I can relate to every emotion and worry you wrote about. Great piece!
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bronxboy55
September 10, 2013
Well, I guess I’m sorry to hear that, although I’m happy that you liked the piece. More to come.
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ranu802
September 9, 2013
Thanks for sharing.
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bronxboy55
September 10, 2013
Thanks for reading.
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susielindau
September 9, 2013
Somehow I escaped all the fire and brimstone while growing up in Madison, Wisconsin. Maybe I missed out!
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Allan Douglas
September 9, 2013
I lived in Madison Wisconsin (Monona actually, I worked in Madison) for a few years. Except for those 6 weeks a year of summer, the heat from a little hellfire would have been welcomed.
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susielindau
September 9, 2013
I know what you mean about their winters!
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bronxboy55
September 10, 2013
Did either of you ever try praying for shorter winters?
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susielindau
September 10, 2013
Not that I recall. I loved winter!!!
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reinventionofmama
September 11, 2013
Ha!!!
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reinventionofmama
September 9, 2013
Interesting! Thanks for the post!
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bronxboy55
September 10, 2013
And thank you for the comment, Mama.
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reinventionofmama
September 10, 2013
I feel like I should note when I read your posts I hear them in Anthony Bordain’s voice. Secret’s out.
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Allan Douglas
September 9, 2013
And lets not forget the most commonly uttered complaint against the Hades Hilton: the linen napkins are ALWAYS soiled.
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bronxboy55
September 10, 2013
Stained linen and stained souls: there must be a connection there somewhere.
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jeanjames
September 9, 2013
My friends Irish mother used to threaten her kids with being sent to Bellevue if they were bad in this lifetime, I’m not sure which is worse. As always, I enjoyed your post.
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bronxboy55
September 10, 2013
That’s funny, Jean. My mother used to say that we were going to send her to Bellevue if we didn’t stop driving her crazy.
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atkokosplace
September 9, 2013
Great post. Very much enjoy your writings and look forward to each post! Have an awesome day!
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bronxboy55
September 10, 2013
Thank you for the kind words, koko. You have an awesome day, too.
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scribblechic
September 9, 2013
I might pen a ticket to Sam Hill Station for the gift of such easy wit.
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bronxboy55
September 10, 2013
You have no need to barter.
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subodai213
September 9, 2013
Charles: your next assignment: describing Heaven. Having gone to Catholic school as well, Heaven was described as a place that nuns, priests, and the folks who never ever sinned or missed Mass went to. It seemed to consist of clouds and one’s job (strike one) was to adore God. Period. Oh, and the saints were there, with a list of names of those who’d prayed to them for interceding on one’s behalf. I often wondered, if I didn’t pray to a saint, would I be stuck at the end of the line getting into Heaven? What if I didn’t have enough prayer credit built up with ‘all the angels and saints’? What happened if I didn’t pray to them all? Would I be sent to Purgatory, where, I was told, EVENTUALLY, I’d get my ticket to Heaven?
Purgatory didn’t seem so bad. I figured that’s where I was going to go ANYWAY.
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bronxboy55
September 9, 2013
This is going to be at least a three-part post, and more likely four. I hate to be so predictable, but your comment is basically an outline of the next two parts. I have a feeling you and I could spend hours talking about these common thoughts, fears, and worries.
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subodai213
September 10, 2013
Eeehheeee, I think you are correct. You and I seem to have been raised in the same circumstances. I can just see us nattering about Catholic schools and ‘ism…and everyone else around is bored out of their skulls. My husband once said, how is that you managed to go through Catholic school and still come out…normal??
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bronxboy55
September 11, 2013
How long have you been married? And he still thinks you’re normal?
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subodai213
September 12, 2013
Only seven years. (this is my third marriage). Let’s put it this way…he’s so kind hearted and tactful, I wouldn’t be surprised if he tells me I’m normal even when I’m not 😉
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earthriderjudyberman
September 9, 2013
I was a Lutheran until I was 21. Then I converted to Catholicism. Purgatory seemed like a reasonable alternative – there was a chance to work off your transgressions and still make it to Heaven. But the thought of Hades/Hell was scary enough … and that was way before I read The Exorcist. (That was far scarier than the movie.)
As always a thoughtful post, Charles.
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bronxboy55
September 10, 2013
Things would seem a lot bleaker with just the two options, wouldn’t they? I don’t think I ever really appreciated the concept of Purgatory quite as much as I should have.
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morristownmemos by Ronnie Hammer
September 9, 2013
You are an intelligent, thinking person to be able to disengage yourself from the teachings of your youth and determine for yourself what made sense to you and what did not. Good for you, Charles! I applaud you.
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bronxboy55
September 11, 2013
Thanks, Ronnie. But I think the disengagement process will be complete only when I’ve stopped writing about it.
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Philster999
September 9, 2013
Can’t say that I’ve ever used up much time worrying about hell as an actual locale, though by mid-morning most days I usually find myself convinced that, as Satre suggested, “l’enfer, c’est les autres.” (Pardon my French — again!) In any case, I gotta admit that “another taste of youth” certainly sounds more and more tempting as the years speed by. Great blog — looking forward to Part 2.
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bronxboy55
September 11, 2013
Another taste of youth, yes, but with the wisdom we’ve acquired with age. (Would that sound more believable in French?)
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reinventionofmama
September 11, 2013
Another taste of youth knowing what we know now… Sign me up as long as I could still end up with my daughters and husband. 🙂
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bronxboy55
September 12, 2013
Very nice, Mama. I hope they get to read that.
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reinventionofmama
September 9, 2013
Hello, hello! I nominated you for several awards, please check out my post to see! – Mama
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bronxboy55
September 11, 2013
Thanks, Mama. And congratulations again — I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone get that many awards all at one time.
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reinventionofmama
September 11, 2013
Thanks! I had to read it sixteen times to be sure I wasn’t snagging one!
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shoreacres
September 10, 2013
Sometimes your experiences are so far from my experiences I hardly know what to say. I can’t remember ever being particularly worried about hell. The way I figured it, God loved me, and someone who loved me wouldn’t send me to a bad place, so I was free to cross hell off my list of things to contemplate.
Now that I think about it, I never even worried about the last judgment. Once it occurred to me that “last judgment” means an end to judgment, and God gets the final word, there was nothing to worry about there, either. That snotty cheerleader who kept telling me I didn’t measure up would just have to stuff it.
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bronxboy55
September 11, 2013
You stick a five-year-old in a school where all of the authority figures are teaching and preaching about death, sin, and eternal punishment, and it’s going to make an impression, one that isn’t easily shaken off. I’m glad you didn’t experience it. On the other hand, I never had to deal with cheerleaders.
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mybrightlife
September 10, 2013
My edgy cuz always says with a spark in his eye, ” please don’t let me end up in heaven, I want to be in hell where the skanky girls hang out!’ This post reminded me of that. Loved it.
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bronxboy55
September 11, 2013
See, I’ve never had that image of Hell, where people are hanging out and having fun. It’s always been fourth-degree burns and a lot of loud noise, and I don’t especially like either.
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mybrightlife
September 11, 2013
His comment was a revelation for me. I no longer believe in heaven or hell but I wish I had been given this pespective earlier, I might have struggled less trying to make sense of it all.
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Anonymous
September 10, 2013
…Pouring myself a tall frosty beverage (love the chink of ice in the glass), and, once refreshed from the flames of hell and that incinerator you described so well, I will await your next installment. Let’s hope for cooler, happier days! Brilliant post. It is also fascinating from the perspective of your ability as a writer; you bring to terrifying life something that a.) you have not actually experienced, and b.) something that does not even exist in reality. Well done!
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bronxboy55
September 11, 2013
I copied most of it from my second-grade religion book.
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justawesomewritings
September 10, 2013
How do you do this.
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justawesomewritings
September 10, 2013
I think I’ll keep the picture of the devil with the ball point pen.
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bronxboy55
September 12, 2013
Just don’t ask him to autograph it for you.
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architect of the jungle
September 10, 2013
What struck me most about this post was the devil’s need to trick people into handing over their souls. Like he really needed to work up a pitch, dress well, have a nice pen, all that, so people would say, here, take it, I’ll have what she’s having. I think he finally realized he was going about it all wrong. Instead of acting like he wanted your valuable soul, and for what, really, he was just going to toss the damn thing down the drain anyway. Instead of all that, I think he realized it was easier to get people to dispose of the inconvenient things themselves. I think he did this by acting like he no longer cared about souls, as if the heart of us was no longer relevant. Brilliant marketing approach. He no longer needed us to fear hell. No longer needed us to think of ways to keep our behinds out of it. He found a way to show us our own ugliness. Now that we see it, we no longer fear eternal damnation, instead we fear ourselves, which I suppose is how it should have been all along. I guess the old demon did us a favor.
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Mrs. B
September 10, 2013
I read this and thought “Wow, this comment nailed it.” Then I looked at the author. Of course it’s you. 🙂
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architect of the jungle
September 10, 2013
Well, I am a carpenter’s daughter 🙂
Love the new blog, btw.
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bronxboy55
September 12, 2013
Your comment made me think of the scandals that have become so common in our culture — but even more, the way so many people are willing to humiliate themselves and others, all for the sake of a little fame, and probably a book deal. The concept of shame seems to be disappearing.
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architect of the jungle
September 12, 2013
So true, but is shame really just a concept? I guess the civilized mind is kind of an invention, a useful collective of abstractions we’ve worked up over the millennia, necessitating the concrete behaviors we determine acceptable. I really sorta miss shame though. It made life so much more dramatic, variegated. What have we replaced it with? Anything?
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Chichina
September 10, 2013
Ah the Catholic guilt and angst! So glad my father was a card carrying Communist who forbade “religion” in our house. It allowed me to explore spirituality without the yoke of indoctrination. Have you noticed how island people do the sign of the cross whenever they drive past a Cathedral? Weird. Very weird……
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bronxboy55
September 12, 2013
It’s been fifteen years, and I could count on one hand the number of times I’ve been in a car with an Islander. Equally weird.
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Chichina
September 12, 2013
Tis weird.
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Mrs. B
September 10, 2013
Thanks, I am going to be cursing you when I can’t sleep tonight. On a serious note, if my adult imagination cannot handle the notion of Hell, imagine how kids feel (well, I guess we don’t have to imagine it because you just told us. 🙂 ).
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bronxboy55
September 12, 2013
You know, I understand the value of teaching young kids about right and wrong, and consequences. But I also can’t bear to think of the number of people — probably millions — who have been damaged by some of this dogma. I remember one nun telling us that if we ever had doubtful thoughts, they were a sign that Satan was trying to take over our minds. What better way to guarantee thoughts about anything than telling someone not to have them?
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sometimesisleep
September 10, 2013
My own picture of the afterlife has gotten simpler as I’ve aged. Hell is now just a separation from God. Most of the details don’t catch my imagination. However, my personal dogma says that in Hell, the only fountain pen belongs to Satan and it is a beauty. The rest of the poor souls write with plastic, skipping, clumpy, blue- inked ballpoint pens… or is that the Department of Motor Vehicles? Either way.
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bronxboy55
September 11, 2013
It’s amazing that you mentioned the Department of Motor Vehicles. There is a connection, but not until Part 3. (How did you know?)
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sometimesisleep
September 12, 2013
It’s a given component of Hell.
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snoozybutsnoopy
September 11, 2013
Reblogged this on SnoozyButSnoopy and commented:
Afterthoughts (Part 1)
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bronxboy55
September 12, 2013
Thank you (again)!
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Wyrd Smythe
September 11, 2013
Ah, it’s amazing how our early religious programming screws us up for life, isn’t it? (And I say that as one of the screwed up. I got into science and science fiction at an early age, and that helped mitigate the effects of the programming a lot.)
Science fiction has many depictions of Heaven/Hell, looking at it from various angles. (That all kind of started with Dante’s Inferno.) I always like the more inventive ideas: Hell as a bureaucracy, for example (ala Beetlejuice), or as a seedy hotel room where the Hell is other people (ala No Exit (or The Devil In Miss Jones, for that matter)). It has certainly been my experience that people bring Hell to Earth (but they can bring Heaven, too, so it balances out).
Frankly, the simple solution is to switch to Buddhism… no Heaven or Hell… just worries about coming back as a cockroach.
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bronxboy55
September 12, 2013
I think science and religion can get along just fine together, as long as we remember that one of them attempts to test the truth, while the other offers symbolic guidance. When their roles are confused, neither holds up very well.
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Wyrd Smythe
September 14, 2013
Indeed. I’ve written quite a few blog posts seeking to reconcile science and spirituality (which I feel are Yin and Yang in life). The latter may turn out to be some kind of mental illusion, but I personally feel there is evidence to support its reality (why do I feel awe at the stars, for example, or why can I feel inspired at all?).
Religion, however, is another matter, and I speak as a Preacher’s Kid. The first thing to recognize is that religions are, in general, organizations with all the same nonsense that goes on in any organization. Specifically, they are comprised of humans, and humans, as the old saying goes, err.
The second thing is that religions are based on ancient ideas and superstitions. If one really must formalize their spirituality, fine, but at least base it on the modern state of humanity.
And finally, simply put, “worldly religion” is an oxymoron.
From a strictly evolutionary biology point of view, one can ask what evolutionary value religion has. Something that is so universal among humans begs for an explanation. One is that religion helps build community. (Another is that we’re all apprehending something real.) But to the extent that it’s a evolutionary, it might be nice to update it for modern society. (I’ve always thought the Unitarians had their heads on pretty straight.)
If you’d like to read more:
http://logosconcarne.com/2011/07/31/big-bang-let-there-be-light/
http://logosconcarne.com/2011/08/02/god-universal-apprehension-or-delusion/
http://logosconcarne.com/2011/08/07/existence-and-consciousness/
http://logosconcarne.com/2011/08/14/god-three-questions/
http://logosconcarne.com/2012/10/07/decisive-agnosticism/
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daisy
September 11, 2013
Charles, I like your posts because they speak two sides of an issue with complete fluency. The spirit of this line at the beginning, “axe murderers and also people who had forgotten to go to church one Sunday and then stepped out into the street without looking both ways,” was echoed throughout your post. Your discourse on death presents such a horrifying “afterthought” (nice title) and then in the same breath tempers it with a little grace (humor). So enjoyable! I look forward to the rest of the series.
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bronxboy55
September 12, 2013
Thanks, Melissa. I sometimes wish I could be one of those people who can filter out the contradictions and questions and just leave them behind. But only sometimes.
Thank you, as always, for your thoughtful feedback and support. It means a lot.
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rangewriter
September 12, 2013
Another stellar essay, Charles. “I love this: Had it been just moderately unpleasant, it might have been called Heck, or Sam Hill Station, or maybe the Hades Motor Lodge, with the ferrymen on the rivers to the underworld offering light refreshments to their passengers.” This passage so encapsulates your style while making me green with envy! Not for your hell, but for your way with words.
I like that descriptions of hell actually piqued your curiosity. I remember those grisly films that we were shown when I was in junior high, nasty shots of drunk teens slamming into tree trunks and wrapping their cars into doughnut shapes. And then, the psychedelics….oh, those LSD scaries intrigued the hell out of me. Oh, no pun intended….
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bronxboy55
September 13, 2013
I’m always intrigued by the detailed descriptions, Linda. I can’t imagine that if there were such a place as Hell, anyone would have been able to pay a visit, then come back to tell about it. I think we get most of those images from paintings.
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rangewriter
September 13, 2013
And the artists got the images from their worst nightmares.
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Mitch Mitchell
September 12, 2013
You know, I’ve never used a fountain pen; that might be interesting to try one day. As for the afterlife, I can’t say I’ve ever really believed in it. As a child the thought of it scared me but once I realized I was more scared of certain movies than such a thing I moved on. In a weird way the problem with religion is that you have to believe in evil entities and, well, my mind just can’t get around that one.
Still, it would have been cool to see that 3-headed dog, but I’ll have to make due with the 1st Harry Potter movie. 😉
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bronxboy55
September 13, 2013
I wouldn’t recommend trying a fountain pen, Mitch. It’ll drive you crazy. As for evil entities, I think they’re just another one of those ways that humans have found to shift blame. We commit atrocious acts, then say the devil made us do it. I really don’t think demons exist. Well, except for those fountain pens.
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Martin Tjandra
September 12, 2013
I love myths and stories, hell and hades are two of them. The problem is that I believe hell is real. So that makes my reading time becomes sucks. 😀
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bronxboy55
September 13, 2013
I know a lot of people who believe that, Martin. I guess there’s no way to be sure, until we find out — or we don’t.
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icedteawithlemon
September 12, 2013
I’m traveling down that same road toward skepticism–perhaps not quite as far along the path as you, but similar doubts plague me no matter how hard I try to ignore them.
I used to teach “The Devil and Daniel Webster” by Stephen Vincent Benet and “The Devil and Tom Walker” by Washington Irving, and as I was reading your post it brought back fond memories of both short stories about Old Scratch and his sneaky, wicked ways. Your story-telling abilities are every bit as enjoyable as the abilities of those two great authors, and I’m looking forward to the upcoming installments.
And I loved the inclusion of the traveler’s review–nice touch!
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bronxboy55
September 13, 2013
Thanks, Karen. It’s always fun to write about intangible places and things, because you can take it almost anywhere. I sometimes wonder what images formed in the minds of my classmates as these after-death destinations were described to us. I imagine they were all slightly different.
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kalabalu
September 13, 2013
The one question your wrote..what”Those souls were valuable assets. I was never quite sure what gave them such worth ” the worth is simple , how many ready to do right and all others happy to find or make any reason, for being in wrong path. Those of us, who are in wrong may or may not end up in hell..since it is a one way ticket..but ..correctly said..there is hopelessness which is more scary than fire..here a life with one death ..there a life with many deaths ..yet death does not end miseries that are lasting forever..it is scary..I will not comment on religious believes, it is not my subject. But..as a thought..your Afterthoughts Part 1, is making one point clear. After death..we are no longer in control of our fate..seems ..we leave our will here on earth as we venture into the next..just as no one asked us to arrive here..no one tells us, its time to go..but where ..is the crucial question.We did not create this huge universe, nor the heavens or hell..we never did..
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bronxboy55
September 13, 2013
For me, the strangest aspect of the whole issue is that we can only find out if there is an afterlife. If there isn’t, we’re just left hanging in the dark, so to speak. But either way, thanks for the comment.
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Valentine Logar
September 14, 2013
Having just started to follow you I am happy this is the first reading, it is well written and speaks to a subject many recovering Catholics like me often consider in our move away from the Church. One of my larger questions was always why I had to pay to pray souls out of Purgatory, wouldn’t my prayers (without payment) be enough to get them out? And where did Purgatory come from?
Like you I am a skeptic.
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bronxboy55
October 3, 2013
It seems that once you’re able to step back and look at the teachings from a detached perspective, it’s all about control through fear. For me, the real miracle is how they managed to connect that approach to a message about love and tolerance, and convince billions of people to follow it.
Thanks for the kind words.
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gliderpilotlee
September 14, 2013
Great writing, I read a few replies, such good people to have figured it out. I can only remember being reprimanded twice -or so- . By the time I could truly comprehend what hell could be around age 5, I was lucky and able to test some BS. About that age I had a delirious fever, the ceiling moved continuously. “This feels awful, would you pray for me” I begged my truly treasured Pentecostal Mother, aannnd , sure enough — I was hungry and feeling much better in a couple hours when the fever went away. time passed but this crossed my mind Maybe the next time I feel like fresh cow shit baking in a Kansas summer sun, I’ll just hold out another couple hours. “Sure enough” Hoo, whaat? You dumb asses! That god shit never worked and never will work. Hell (chuckle) “we” can make a headache worse by concentrating on how could I make this moment the worst, and milk it for all I can, or take a pill with nothing in it and suddenly feel better in 3 min.
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bronxboy55
October 3, 2013
Your fever story illustrates how many beliefs and superstitions must have come about. Whatever we were doing or whatever was happening at the moment when things changed must have somehow caused the change. I think our brains are wired to come to those conclusions.
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lolarugula
September 14, 2013
I grew up attending a Lutheran school but was surrounded by a group of catholic friends. The idea of purgatory always fascinated me. It was like you were on your way to hell but maybe there was a way out? I still don’t really understand it, mostly because I don’t really care. Even after having the bible dissected for me for so many years, I have trouble believing in the literal hell.
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bronxboy55
October 3, 2013
As an adult, I can look at it all now and see how obviously man-made those teachings are. But when you take children who are three or four years old and drum these things into their vulnerable little minds, those ideas take up residence and are very hard to evict completely. I can’t completely rule out the possibility of an afterlife, but anyone who believes they can describe it in any kind of detail is deluding themselves. The value of their faith, I think, is that it provides comfort and structure.
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lolarugula
October 3, 2013
I believe in an afterlife, I’m just not a believer in hell, as it’s typically depicted. You’re right, it is very hard to evict from our heads ideas that have been drummed into them from an early age. I like to believe in the good afterlife, I guess, mostly because I’ve lost a number of close loved-ones. I’d like to believe that evil people just go away, much like I wish they’d do here on earth.
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roughdraftliving
September 14, 2013
I absolutely loved this!! I am a cradle Catholic educated in the schools, which taught us as children it was hopeless. What were the chance of dying 2 seconds after stepping out of the confessional? In fourth grade I gave up. I could do whatever I wanted because in the long run it wouldn’t make a difference. I was going to eventually reside in hell.
As I matured, I came to believe hell is probably a separation of the soul from God or all that is good. Which in itself would be scary and sad enough.
I actually work for the church and I’m still a faithful Catholic. I see how the church has changed for the better. There is still a lot that puzzles me, but all religions puzzle me. It’s not me and a church. It’s me and my relationship with Jesus Christ. I approach faith using what is good for me from the church and taking my instruction and comfort from the Holy Spirit.
We probably think much different, but that’s okay. I’ve had times when I thought the whole God thing was made up by wise men, who knew to avoid total fear and misery we had to come up with something so we could live with some kind of hope. I spoke to a priest about this one time and he said it’s common to get these feelings and that means we are examining our faith. I was not chastised. Honestly, I decided a long time ago to err on the side of caution!
You are a great writer and love the humor!
Peace,
Deb
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bronxboy55
October 3, 2013
Thank you for the thoughtful comment, Deb. As I read your words, I realized that our feelings about a religion are largely affected by individual representatives of that religion — just as we may love or hate geometry, depending on the teacher we got, or like or despise a certain company based on how we were treated by the receptionist who happened to answer the phone. I’m glad you found a priest who encourages people to examine their faith. I was taught that those doubts and questions were evidence that the devil was working inside my mind, which was a scary thing for a child to imagine.
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ShimonZ
September 17, 2013
Don’t know why the comments were closed on part 2… but it seems to me that when we’re children, we think we’re going to live for ever. So ever and ever means even longer than childhood. Always enjoy your humorous approach.
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bronxboy55
October 3, 2013
Also, when we’re children, childhood is all we’ve ever known, so we can’t even imagine how long it will take to become adults. I remember seeing the eighth-grade students at our school as being old giants.
I closed comments once I realized how long this post was going to go. I wanted to get it all out first, just to avoid getting into a discussion about something I hadn’t yet written about.
Thanks, Shimon. I always appreciate your thoughts.
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silkpurseproductions
September 17, 2013
Once again, you have made me grateful for not being raised Catholic.
My grandmother was terrifying enough punishing me for being a “bastard child”. I always felt safe at my church and often went there for comfort but we were never given those “hell and damnation” terrorizing speeches in Sunday School. If I had been raised Catholic I doubt I would still be a Christian.
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bronxboy55
October 3, 2013
I’m sorry to hear about the punishment you received from your grandmother, Michelle — especially for something over which you had no control. Have you written about it somewhere?
I hope you’re feeling better and enjoying a cool October.
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silkpurseproductions
October 3, 2013
I had to go back and look at what I wrote when you mentioned my grandmother in your reply. I seldom mention her and I don’t believe I have ever put anything about her in writing. It must have been my pain medication loosening my writing tongue. 😉 . Your piece must have made me feel comfortable enough to talk about her.
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reneejohnsonwrites
September 27, 2013
As the good southerner, I was raised on hell fire and damnation – mostly through the Baptist neighbors. Disclaimer – we were Methodists. I think I may have been the only one in my class at school although there was a respectable number of us in our church. The Methodist version of Hell is a bit tamer. We are creating it for ourselves. Once you realize that, it feels less daunting, but still not quite the destination one should be aiming for.
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gliderpilotlee
September 28, 2013
First, isn’t it cool how bronxboy55 gets the point across?( i’m way too crude) school – neighbors: I discovered early, being the only pentecostal when all the other farm kids (there might have been 10 city kids in the whole high school) were other, that I had to find exceptional people to be friends. My mother is a gem , and meant well, but it was a curse I”m still paying for at age 62.
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bronxboy55
October 3, 2013
That’s an interesting situation, Renee. Were the neighbors preaching their faith directly to you, and if so, how did your family react to that? Telling someone else’s child what to believe has to be one of the surest ways to create conflict. I wonder if gliderpilotlee had similar experiences.
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